Board Thread:Anime/Game Discussion/@comment-29981284-20161228210504/@comment-27894850-20180203041400

HouseBlack wrote: From a technicaly point-of-view, Diavolo did deserve the GER Death Loop. Cause, really, he DID commit an infinite crime.

How "long" of a crime is murder? It depends on the kind of world you live in.

If you live in a world with reincarnation, it's worth the experience of a single death. Cause the person who was murdered had to experience 1 death and then gets to reincarnate.

But in a world without reincarnation, it would have to be worth 1 permament death. Cause the person who was murdered is dead and gone forever. So, in order to be equal, the perpetrator would also have to be dead and gone forever. Otherwise the perpetrator isn't getting a sentence equal to the crime. The victim is gone for all of eternity, so the perpetrator should be gone for all of eternity as well. That is justice. A punishment that matches the crime.

Unfortunately, this is impossible for Diavolo. Because Diavolo murdered more than one person. Which means that he would have to be dead and gone forever more than one time. Which is an oxymoron. You can only be dead and gone forever once. Otherwise it wasn't forever. This means it's impossible to punish Diavolo fittingly.

Unless you use a loophole like GER.

If we're being technical, eternal death is eternal. So no amount of pain, no matter how vast, can equal it. Cause it's eternal.

GER never actually kills Diavolo for good. It just makes him experience death over and over again. So GER never actually gives Diavolo the eternal deaths he deserves. However, since Diavolo can't actually have the multiple eternities of deaths that he deserves, GER is the next best thing.

Since, because he is never dead for good, he is actually receiving a lighter punishment than his crimes warrant. But since it goes on forever, I don't think anyone is going to complain about him getting off lightly.

If we're using pure logic without sentamentality, than the answer to this question is yes. Diavolo deserves his fate. Because he killed multiple people off for good, but he can't be killed off for good multiple times. So instead he experiences pain forever. Cause the worser punishment he deserves is impossible.

Man, it's been a while.

Okay, first off I like this argument - has some really valid points, but I still disagree based on a few things. First off, while death may be permanent life definetly is not. Diavolo did not cause death, he ended life - and while that statement seems paradoxical in nature, I think the important thing here is what is stressed, that being life is not eternal. The people Diavolo killed, no matter how many, and no matter how young were going to die at some point. (Now we could get into immortality arguments, but I think at this point in the jojo continuity and considering the location of the people he killed it would be extremely unlikely immortality could occur) Now this does not absolve Diavolo of his crimes, but considering that he essentially quickened a natural process (albeit in a violent fashion) he doesn't deserve eternal punishment. If we say the natural life of a person is on average 80 years old and normalize the age of those he killed to be 20, and we say he killed ~100 people that would amount to 6,000 collective years of life lost. Now this number is definetly nothing to scoff at but comparing this to eternity it is merely a drop in the bucket, even more so if we consider all the overestimation. Even if we are to go into indirect kills at the greatest estimations being perhaps in the hundreds of thousands of years this is nothing compared to eternity, all of time. The important thing to remember with this is that life is what Diavolo was ending, something that would end regardless. For my second point I'd like to first make clear that I'm not the most keen on the after life in jojo, but from my standpoint there seems to be three different ends for people, first is heaven or something close to it as we see the spirits of characters dying going off to some other realm multiple times, the second being some sort of purgatory/ghost existense - like Diavolo or DMQ's Kira, and then ceasing to exist. My point here is that death isn't nearly as bad as Diavolo's punishment, because for most people it seems that they ascend into the next realm, free of the pain and hardship of life (of course we've never really seen this beyond realm but from the looks of it I doubt it's something horrible) and then there are ghosts who remain until their business is finished. Neither of these ends predispose someone to the terror and pain of death more than once so to say that Diavolo deserves to experience INFINITE deaths (and then saying this is somehow a lighter sentence than just straight up dying) I think is quite sadistic. Something I think the thing people shrug off is the ETERNAL nature of Diavolo's punishment, and not only eternal punishment ETERNAL PAIN AND TERROR just after a few deaths we can see Diavolo cowering from a little girl, he's already broken - and to say that he should have to face that FAR after the deaths he caused were atoned for many times over is imprudent and most definetly does not reflect true justice, or a fair punishment equal to the crime.

If we're using pure logic here and not sentimentality then I think the best conclusion is that murder, a hanis crime in its own right does not incur the punishment of torture that will never end. Once again I'd like to reiterate Diavolo's punishment is far too harsh on the grounds that it is going far beyond the bounds of what he did, he did not set in motion something that wouldn't have happened otherwise, people die regardless of how it occurs. Now of course I must say, Diavolo did deserve a punishment, that much I agree, but I think this punishment in particular is akin to drawing and quartering someone for stealing a lolipop.