Board Thread:Manga Discussion/@comment-33204772-20190109170729/@comment-38952966-20200908002401

Mystic Mania wrote: No offense but your list is basically the same as saying the JoJo list is:

"Jonathan, Joseph, Jolyne, Josuke, Gappy, Jotaro, Johnny, Giorno". You're making assumptions about certain stats that just aren't true ( such as Part 4 being faster than Part 1. ) Like, I agree with certain things you said, such as DIO not breaking Love Train, not catching up to MIH, and just not having the AP to kill Kars, but other things such as Valentine being able to pull Kars into another dimension before Kars can kill him just doesn't have anything solid backing it up.

Also, I don't feel you really backed up why the Hanged Man feat isn't lightspeed. You just said it wasn't, but why?

Well I explicitly said that Valentine would be lower on the list without Love Train, but with Love Train, how is Kars going to stop him? He can't even touch him.

I try to avoid assumptions whenever possible, but I'll include ones that I think are logical. As far as I remember, the fastest we ever see a character in parts 1 and 2 move is when they dodge Space Ripper Stingy Eyes, but we don't have any scaling to say how fast the Stingy Eyes are. Since there are no other moments in parts 1 or 2 indicate characters going above peak human speed, it's safe to assume they're rather slow compared to later character speeds.

Comparatively, characters in the later parts scale much higher. Crazy Diamond can catch bullets and outspeed Killer Queen without much difficulty, Killer Queen can outspeed Echoes ACT 3, and Echoes ACT 3 can still move fast enough to distort the wind around it (much faster than any human). I try to avoid relying on Stand stats because they're mostly inconsistent horseshit. In general, throughout the entire series, the large majority of Stands outspeed humans by quite a margin.

I've already explained the Hanged Man, but I guess I'll do it again: The Hanged Man is confirmed lightspeed. Polnareff is consistently unable to equal its speed, until he realizes he can intercept Hanged Man as long as he knows its trajectory. Polnareff explicitly states that he cannot hit something moving as fast as Hanged Man without knowing where it will go. So right away, we confirm that Silver Chariot can't even reach lightspeed, much less exceed it. However, Silver Chariot is still a very precise Stand, so as long as he knows where Hanged Man is going and when he's going to move there, he can time his hit just right and slice him.

That's why I made the baseball comparison earlier. You can hit a baseball moving at 100mph without moving the bat at 100mph, as long as you know where the ball is going and when the pitcher throws it. The same is true of Silver Chariot, and we know it because Polnareff specifically says so. If Silver Chariot could outspeed Hanged Man, there would've been no point in Kakyoin's coin trick. The coin was necessary specifically because Silver Chariot isn't lightspeed.

Feel free to criticize any points I've made. It's been a hot minute since I've read parts 1 and 2 so it's possible I've forgotten something.