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  • Love Train is activate before the fight


    So, can GER negate Love Train or not?

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    • It can just set it to zero, to my understanding

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    • Good question, I think it would be a stalemate. GER would probably be unable to break through love train. But D4C can't attack GER.

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    • Complete stomp by GER. Love Train would just cease to exist and return to normal D4C, probably. Can say that GER wins because GER is far stronger than Tusk Act 4, which beat D4C:Love Train



      GER wins by powerscaling basically

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    • Depends entirely on the application of powers. If JJBA has taught us anything; it's that pure power does not inherently mean a win. Namedly; What if D4C -LoveTrain- just pulls Giorno out of the main reality? Giorno would cease to exist in the base reality as only D4C has the ability to allow things  in multiple realities to exist in one space at one time. GER wouldn't be able to just will itself back into the main reality because of the reality lock on it's powers. 

      (This is Omni-Reality warp vs Fixed-Reality warp.) D4C/Valentine can just hop to a reality where Giorno never existed or simply didnt acquire requiem and pull that version of him back to the 'base' reality (and only D4C has the ability to do or undo this). It is also stated that the only power able to breakthrough -LoveTrain- is the Super Spin. If D4C is already in -LoveTrain- it CANNOT be beaten or touched by anything other than Super Spin. Giorno does not know the Super Spin, let alone how to apply Spin at all. Valentine can affect multiple realities whereas GER only affects the base WHILE IT IS ALLOWED TO EXIST THERE. 

      ^above situations result in a D4C faceroll with no effort at all. Since OP said Lovetrain is active at start and canonically it is stated only Super Spin can bypass the lightwall to affect Valentine or D4C in LoveTrain. Its an absolute roflstomp. 

      (sorry for necro)

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    • I gotta disagree. There's nothing that Valentine can do if GER doesn't want it to. D4C tries to pull Giorno to another reality? Set it to zero before it happens. GER's ability isn't limited by time, hell he reverts an action that occurred during time that was erased by King Crimson. Reverting actions during time that doesn't even exist is solid indication that GER isn't affected by time like most Stands are.

      I also see no reason to believe that GER is reality locked. It sends Diavolo to seemingly infinite dimensions to die forever, indicating it has some degree of transdimensional control.

      It doesn't really matter if GER can break through Love Train or not, because it can always set Love Train back to zero. Again, it's actions aren't limited to any period of time, so even if Love Train is already active before the fight, GER can still set it back to zero, and finish the fight with a good ol' muda.

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    • Kingasdfg wrote: I gotta disagree. There's nothing that Valentine can do if GER doesn't want it to. D4C tries to pull Giorno to another reality? Set it to zero before it happens. GER's ability isn't limited by time, hell he reverts an action that occurred during time that was erased by King Crimson. Reverting actions during time that doesn't even exist is solid indication that GER isn't affected by time like most Stands are.

      I also see no reason to believe that GER is reality locked. It sends Diavolo to seemingly infinite dimensions to die forever, indicating it has some degree of transdimensional control.

      It doesn't really matter if GER can break through Love Train or not, because it can always set Love Train back to zero. Again, it's actions aren't limited to any period of time, so even if Love Train is already active before the fight, GER can still set it back to zero, and finish the fight with a good ol' muda.

      The thing is..we don’t know if GER can affect Time that doesn’t exist. Diavolo doesn’t physically erase time...he just renders everything useless and so that it cannot be remembered which gives it the erase feeling

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    • El Pimpo Huarez
      El Pimpo Huarez removed this reply because:
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      13:33, May 1, 2019
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    • CrimsonDiavolo wrote:

      Kingasdfg wrote: I gotta disagree. There's nothing that Valentine can do if GER doesn't want it to. D4C tries to pull Giorno to another reality? Set it to zero before it happens. GER's ability isn't limited by time, hell he reverts an action that occurred during time that was erased by King Crimson. Reverting actions during time that doesn't even exist is solid indication that GER isn't affected by time like most Stands are.

      I also see no reason to believe that GER is reality locked. It sends Diavolo to seemingly infinite dimensions to die forever, indicating it has some degree of transdimensional control.

      It doesn't really matter if GER can break through Love Train or not, because it can always set Love Train back to zero. Again, it's actions aren't limited to any period of time, so even if Love Train is already active before the fight, GER can still set it back to zero, and finish the fight with a good ol' muda.

      The thing is..we don’t know if GER can affect Time that doesn’t exist. Diavolo doesn’t physically erase time...he just renders everything useless and so that it cannot be remembered which gives it the erase feeling

      Lol no Diavolo straight up erases time. People lose their memories because there are no memories to call upon, as the actions they're trying to remember have been erased. That's why Aerosmith's bullets were able to fly right through Diavolo during the Metallica fight, because he erased the time where they hit him. Epitaph wouldn't be much use as a sub-ability is King Crimson didn't straight up erase time.

      Not that it matters greatly to the argument, I'm still convinced that GER is above multiverse levels of power because of what it did to Diavolo.

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    • King Crimson doesn’t erase time...we even saw it in the anime to confirm his ability...when he activates it he becomes Immune to all attacks and it nullifies everything. It was literally confirmed in the anime

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    • CrimsonDiavolo wrote:
      King Crimson doesn’t erase time...we even saw it in the anime to confirm his ability...when he activates it he becomes Immune to all attacks and it nullifies everything. It was literally confirmed in the anime

      King Crimson erases time. It's typed in its page.

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    • CrimsonDiavolo wrote: King Crimson doesn’t erase time...we even saw it in the anime to confirm his ability...when he activates it he becomes Immune to all attacks and it nullifies everything. It was literally confirmed in the anime


      You're taking the literal interpretation of its power as opposed to the actual one. It's like saying that "The World doesn't stop time, it just makes it so that nothing else can move and nobody is able to remember". Like, yes that is the literal explanation of its power but the reason it's able to do this is because The World stops time.

      The same is true with King Crimson. The reason it becomes immune to attacks and no one can remember what happens is precisely because it erases time.

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    • If King Crimson could erase time then no action done within it would happen. He’s able to move objects around that aren’t fated to be moved and slash his own body and throw blood. If time was erased, those actions would have been erased as well.

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    • King Crimson allows only Diavolo to change his fate(the outcome of his actions) in erased time,that's why he can reposition himself to kill an enemy quickly with a fatal blow from King Crimson.

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    • And he can also move objects..? Whatever, I need to go to school, but when I get back I’m going to research this shit more.

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    • Well Diavolo's clothes count as objects,don't they?So I guess he can move some objects.

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    • Bruh

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    • He cleaned up his room in erased time before

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    • Maybe he can only interact with inorganic things.

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    • Time cannot be erased. At the moment of "Time erase/skip (TS)" everyone sees the reality that would be if KC didnt use his ability at that moment (All actions started before TS, would continue normally, exacly how it would happen), while making Diavolo invulnerable and able to change this fate.

      Its been showed that people and objects move during it (Bruno attacking, creating zippers; Diavolo cleaning up the room), which definatly means time isnt erased completely, rather its erased from everybodies mind, except from Diavolo.

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    • Gakamis wrote: Time cannot be erased. At the moment of "Time erase/skip (TS)" everyone sees the reality that would be if KC didnt use his ability at that moment (All actions started before TS, would continue normally, exacly how it would happen), while making Diavolo invulnerable and able to change this fate.

      Its been showed that people and objects move during it (Bruno attacking, creating zippers; Diavolo cleaning up the room), which definatly means time isnt erased completely, rather its erased from everybodies mind, except from Diavolo.

      But time is actually being erased. That's why Diavolo isn't affected by attacks during that period, ex. Aerosmith's bullets. It's kinda silly to say "Time cannot be erased" as an argument. It's like saying there's no such thing as a mirror world, right?

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    • Kingasdfg wrote:

      But time is actually being erased. That's why Diavolo isn't affected by attacks during that period, ex. Aerosmith's bullets. It's kinda silly to say "Time cannot be erased" as an argument. It's like saying there's no such thing as a mirror world, right?

      Okay, that part may not realy work, sure. But I completely disagree on king crimson being able to completely erase time. Aerosmiths bullet passed because KC in invulnerable in TS, but they were passing/moving meaning that time flow was how it was supposted to be. 

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    • If Araki says that KC erases time,then he does,you can't debate this,the author's word is not something that is up to interpretation.Even if the ability doesn't make any sense logically or is inconsistent,in universe KC erases time,whatever that means and does,you can't change that.

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    • Gakamis wrote:

      Kingasdfg wrote:

      But time is actually being erased. That's why Diavolo isn't affected by attacks during that period, ex. Aerosmith's bullets. It's kinda silly to say "Time cannot be erased" as an argument. It's like saying there's no such thing as a mirror world, right?

      Okay, that part may not realy work, sure. But I completely disagree on king crimson being able to completely erase time. Aerosmiths bullet passed because KC in invulnerable in TS, but they were passing/moving meaning that time flow was how it was supposted to be. 


      We, the audience, see what Diavolo sees. The reason we see things moving is because Diavolo sees them moving before he erases them. There is a ten second period of time where actions do no affect Diavolo, but can still have other consequences. When the 10 seconds runs out, all the actions that occurred during that time are erased but their consequences remain. Like, if Diavolo used his ability, none of what occurred in that 10 seconds would show up on a video camera or anything. The consequences remain, but the actions themselves are gone.

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    • but if the concequences remain then wouldnt the bullets just end up hitting diavolo anyway because the concequences are him getting shot up by aerosmith

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    • Diavolo enters his own little dimension when he “erases” time and he’s Immune to everything in this.

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    • Pretty much.

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    • So who wins exactly??

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    • Neither.

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    • Diavolo does. He was able to defeat Bruno fairly easily and sever Giorno’s arm. Mista and Trish wouldn’t have been a problem

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    • Severing Giorno's arm doesn't mean much.

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    • It showed that he could hold his own against Team Bucciarati. They literally stand no chance against him. He was even able to dodge mista’s bullets without even looking at them in erased time.

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    • This whole thing was a bit of a tangent, anyway. The original question, whether GER could beat Love Train, I think has been answered. GER could set Love Train back to zero without much effort.

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    • But could it realy?

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    • "Gold Experience Requiem's ultimate ability is to turn any of its opponent's attacks and willpower back to the state of "zero", completely nullifying them and preventing them from becoming "real"." That is an excerpt from the wiki. Love train goes to zero and doesn't become real. Just no. Nothing he does can happen. GER is made to be unbeatable. it's power in the broadest of categories is to make anything that happens just not happen.

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    • "The harmful energy that passes through the wall of light is sent far away from the user and is passed onto individuals anywhere on Earth as bad luck." thats from the wiki and based on that GER absolutely wins because he can infinitely reset Love train and what beat love train was infinite rotation from Tusk

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    • TwoGauls wrote:
      "...Love train goes to zero and doesn't become real..."

      But the action of becoming D4C: Love train is already done. It cant just dissapear. If GER could just do stuff like that, it could easily bring back Bruno, Narancia, Abbacchio.

      While yes, D4C: Love Train cannot win (though, perhaps he could bring alternative giorno without GER and somehow make them collide, but GER most likely can reset the collision), but Love Train should definatly let him to flee.

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    • D4C: LT's ability is to 'redirect misfortune'. Basically, if anything that's 'unfortunate' for Valentine, it redirects it somewhere else in the world. Take note, he can only enter dimensions OUTSIDE of Love Train. He can't enter dimensions inside Love Train. So, if Valentine ever wanted to paradox Giorno, he'll just reset Valentine back to when he was in Love Train.

      I don't know about resetting the activation of Love Train itself back to zero, because it's either GER completely ignores its ability or somewhere in the world, someone gets RTZ'd.

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    • LawlesSin wrote: Namedly; What if D4C -LoveTrain- just pulls Giorno out of the main reality? Giorno would cease to exist in the base reality as only D4C has the ability to allow things  in multiple realities to exist in one space at one time. GER wouldn't be able to just will itself back into the main reality because of the reality lock on it's powers. 

      (sorry for necro)


      Yh that's cool and all, except GER exists out of time and space. That's why it was able to move in Diavolo's time erasure. It's literally stated in GE's wiki page.

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    • GER Slaps Love Train,There Was No Contest.

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    • GER wasn't able to stop made in heaven from restarting the univeres effectivly puting heaven ascended stands higher then requium stands and i'd say collecting all of the holy parts would be an equivelent to achiveing heaven. So useing this logic GER woulden't beable to pierce love train

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    • The reason GER couldn't stop Made in Heaven is because it wasn't active. The arrow falls out after the events of Vento Auero, reverting GER back to GE. It's within reason however, that if Giorno reactivated GER, or if GER was permenant, that it would be able to counteract/beat Made in Heaven, or at least make Giorno immune to it. Either way, GER still easily beats D4C - Love Train.

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    • But giorno was nowhere near pucci at the time anyways.

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    • D4c would win because to activate reset to zero giorno needs his fists.

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    • DhStroyer wrote:

      D4c would win because to activate reset to zero giorno needs his fists.

      Since when? GER didn't use it's fists to reset King Crimson.

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    • GER can’t reset anything unless it’s trying to harm him directly. If valentine just has love train on sand GER punches him, it won’t get reverted to zero or anything

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    • This one's tricky. On one hand GER can not harm Valentine while inside the light since all his attacks would go away, on the other hand Love train can't harm GER neither since all his attacks would be nullified. The only way I can think to break the stalemate is if Valentine brings an alternate Giorno for them to collide but even then the range of that is limited and GER Giorno can just fly away

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    • Larry Capucha wrote: This one's tricky. On one hand GER can not harm Valentine while inside the light since all his attacks would go away, on the other hand Love train can't harm GER neither since all his attacks would be nullified. The only way I can think to break the stalemate is if Valentine brings an alternate Giorno for them to collide but even then the range of that is limited and GER Giorno can just fly away

      True. Giorno could also attack valentine if D4C leaves the light to attack.

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    • I don't understand how this is even a question?

      GER didn't need to be in contact with Diavolo to cancel out the skipped time, it only touched him to activate the death loop. GER can say "No." to things just by being aware those things exist; It was even able to enter Diavolo's time-skip pocket dimension just because of that fact.

      Remember that GER has an independent consciousness from Giorno and is able to act independently as well. It's able to do things Giorno isn't aware it's doing, so it isn't even bound by how well Giorno is able to assess the ability of D4C.

      GER squashes Love Train just by saying "No." to its existence and then pummels Valentine into nothingness.

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    • No. GER only canceled out Diavolos time erase when he was about to attack him. If GER could actually do that, it would have reset it the moment the blood touched his eyes.

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    • In Eyes of Heaven GER can reverse things to a previous state, such as reversing tusk and echoes into previous acts, putting time back to normal from made in heaven, and turning ultimate lifeform Kars to his base form. Eyes of Heaven isn't canon plotwise, but it shows a possible application of GER that makes sense with the "setting to zero". We also don't even know all of GER's powers. What we do know is that Love Train isn't invincible, because Tuck ACT 4 was able to attack him to activate the infinite rotation. Love Train reverses bad luck, and anything that can be stopped by good luck is, but cannot stop the inevitable, and I don't see a way for GER to be stopped by any piece of random chance. Either way, Valentine can't pull any AU Giorno's from the alternate dimensions without exiting the light, and he can't move, so Valentines best chance is a stalemate. Also, GER can travel through dimensions and be unaffected by other stands abilities, shown when he invades Diavolo's erased time, so GER should be able to enter Love Train's light. Also, a Requiem stand isn't just a power-up, it specifically gives the power to acheive whatever the user wants most, so it might just gain the ability it needs to beat Love Train, we just haven't seen enough of Requiem stands in general to know the exact outcome.

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    • That actually gets me thinking. Since only one version of something can exist in a dimension. Would giorno die from his alternate self even if GER was activated?

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    • A FANDOM user
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